Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide & FAQ -- Updated for 6.0!

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Stenhaldi
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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide & FAQ -- Updated for 6.0!

Post by Stenhaldi » Wed Oct 15, 2014 8:00 pm

Speaking of gems, you can also put Accurate in red sockets.

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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide & FAQ -- Updated for 6.0!

Post by aggixx » Wed Oct 15, 2014 8:50 pm

And Piercing in blue or yellow sockets, I was lazy :P
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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide & FAQ -- Updated for 6.0!

Post by Stenhaldi » Wed Oct 15, 2014 9:03 pm

I skipped piercing because it only gives 10 crit, although maybe that's just a tooltip error? Seems the perfect piercing alexandrite still gives 20.

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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide & FAQ -- Updated for 6.0!

Post by aggixx » Wed Oct 15, 2014 9:16 pm

Oh, well that is odd. Alrighty then.
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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide / FAQ

Post by Felucia » Wed Oct 15, 2014 9:31 pm

Priority List

#showtooltip Berserk
/cast Tiger’s Fury
/cast Berserk
/cast Incarnation

You may also wish to trigger Incarnation seperately prior to Berserk to prevent unnecessarily losing 1 second of the Berserk buff, but this is a small gain.
With the change to Tiger's Fury and Berserk, wouldn't it be smarter to change the order and put Tiger's Fury after Berserk?

The increased Energy Cap During Berserk would prevent wasting energy, if you are at 40+ Energy.

Edit: Unless i missed that they changed the perk. On beta it still increases your maximum energy by 50. Even then putting it after Berserk would not be a disadvantage in any case.
Last edited by Felucia on Wed Oct 15, 2014 9:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide & FAQ -- Updated for 6.0!

Post by aggixx » Wed Oct 15, 2014 9:39 pm

Woops, accidentally edited your post instead quoting >.<

Yeah once you get the perk you'll want to Berserk first I suppose, at 90 it doesn't matter though. Although I do need to change the Incarnation line because casting it with TF up cancels TF, and you actually have to spell out the full name of the talent now.
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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide & FAQ -- Updated for 6.0!

Post by Felucia » Wed Oct 15, 2014 9:46 pm

aggixx wrote:
Yeah once you get the perk you'll want to Berserk first I suppose, at 90 it doesn't matter though. Although I do need to change the Incarnation line because casting it with TF up cancels TF, and you actually have to spell out the full name of the talent now.
That's weird, hopefully a bug that will be fixed?
Anyways, glad I could help :)
Awesome post btw!

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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide & FAQ -- Updated for 6.0!

Post by aggixx » Wed Oct 15, 2014 10:13 pm

Yeah Tiger's Fury requires you to stay in Cat Form now or it gets removed and Incarnation counts as shapeshifting. Just a bug that hasn't been fixed yet.
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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide & FAQ -- Updated for 6.0!

Post by Chernobylec » Thu Oct 16, 2014 4:01 am

Good day guys! I have some questions for best understanding, because some things were not so clear for me.
1) If I have 3 trinkets from normal the best choice is Harom +Assurance of Consequence instead of Detonator;
2) All gems (agi, agi + mastery) should be changed for crit, crit+haste;
3) All bleeds should be reapplied with remain time less than Pandemic time, just to prevent DPS lost ( if we are talking about improved bleeds with TF and so on. Ordinarily they have to be reapplied at Pandemic time).

Thanks in advance.
P.S. I've never known about this druid forum before TT

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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide & FAQ -- Updated for 6.0!

Post by Parna » Thu Oct 16, 2014 6:14 am

Yo guys! Two simple quest:
- When i'm pulling in prowl for glyph of savage roar proc is it better start with shred or rake?
- During normal rotation if i applied a dot with TF 15% AP buff and Haromm or AoC proc, it's still better TF buff or trinkets ones?

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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide & FAQ -- Updated for 6.0!

Post by Dolenraug » Thu Oct 16, 2014 7:17 am

Stenhaldi wrote:Speaking of gems, you can also put Accurate in red sockets.
It's that thing i can't figure out, is http://wod.wowhead.com/item=76693or http://www.wowhead.com/item=76681 better than the Agi gem, http://www.wowhead.com/item=40112? Cuz every site i have read about this, the Delicate gem isn't even mentioned yet Agi are our prio one?

Regards

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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide & FAQ -- Updated for 6.0!

Post by Amitty » Thu Oct 16, 2014 7:27 am

@Chernobylec
1) AoC+HT in most cases, but it's personal as explained by OP.
2) Red slots = Orange or Purple 10 Crit / 10 Haste, Blue Slots = 20 Crit, Yellow Slots = 20 Crit
3) As far as my knowledge goes the Pandemic mechanic only works if the DoT you are about to apply is the same or weaker than the one you previously had. If the new DoT is stronger (TF / SR / BT) then it's applied with the base duration of Rip and you don't benefit from the Pandemic mechanic.

@Parna
- Shred
- Snapshotting from trinkets is gone. You want all your Rip and Rake bleeds benefiting from TF and SR.

@Dolenraug That's because 10 Crit / 10 Haste gem > 10 Agility gem.

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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide & FAQ -- Updated for 6.0!

Post by Dolenraug » Thu Oct 16, 2014 10:17 am

Amitty wrote:@Dolenraug That's because 10 Crit / 10 Haste gem > 10 Agility gem.
Oh is it so, but then it wouldnt matter what gem i use if 10 Crit / 10 Haste gem equals a 10 Agi gem?

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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide & FAQ -- Updated for 6.0!

Post by Amitty » Thu Oct 16, 2014 10:41 am

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10 Agility gem = 10x7.88 = 78.8
10 Crit / 10 Haste gem = 10x6.87 + 10x4.61 = 68.7 + 46.1 = 114.8

114.8 > 78.8

PS : It seems like Raysere also used the power of math in the fresh thread about gemming.

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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide & FAQ -- Updated for 6.0!

Post by Steakbomb » Thu Oct 16, 2014 11:20 am

No matter how you gear or gem, the biggest difference in actual dps output really is uptime on the boss. Last night when I was testing Aggixx's WAs for him we were comparing dmg breakdowns on Garrosh and the main difference in our dmg output was FB damage and most of that was his uptime on TeD of 33%(or close to that) and my uptime of Harrom's of 15% which equated to his FB dmg avg being 33k and mine being 26k.

Seems that at level 90, feral DPS is all about trinket procs and using those procs well to get off some FBs that are going to hit hard.
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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide & FAQ -- Updated for 6.0!

Post by Simbba » Thu Oct 16, 2014 12:27 pm

So SoTF is best now for both single target & AoE. Last night I did Mythic dmg was good. As for trinket procs how can I track them since my extra CD hasn't been updated and also wanted to know if my gemming is correct I followed what you said Agixx

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/a ... a/advanced

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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide & FAQ -- Updated for 6.0!

Post by Raysere » Thu Oct 16, 2014 12:53 pm

Mongoose now only giving me 63 Agility and 15 haste, Dancing steel grants me 108 Agility. Guessing it's been hotfixed since I checked it last night.

Tol'Vir potion is still giving me more Agility (500) than Virmen's Bite (479) though.

Not checked anything else though, one thing I have noticed is that the tooltips/buff values don't match the character sheet values actually granted by the above things. Can't think of a reason why. Don't have MotW on.

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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide & FAQ -- Updated for 6.0!

Post by aggixx » Thu Oct 16, 2014 1:37 pm

Chernobylec wrote:Good day guys! I have some questions for best understanding, because some things were not so clear for me.
1) If I have 3 trinkets from normal the best choice is Harom +Assurance of Consequence instead of Detonator;
2) All gems (agi, agi + mastery) should be changed for crit, crit+haste;
3) All bleeds should be reapplied with remain time less than Pandemic time, just to prevent DPS lost ( if we are talking about improved bleeds with TF and so on. Ordinarily they have to be reapplied at Pandemic time).
Yup you got it all correct.
Amitty wrote:3) As far as my knowledge goes the Pandemic mechanic only works if the DoT you are about to apply is the same or weaker than the one you previously had. If the new DoT is stronger (TF / SR / BT) then it's applied with the base duration of Rip and you don't benefit from the Pandemic mechanic.
Maybe its just your wording but this is either wrong or misleading. Pandemic always takes place whenever you refresh a DoT or SR. When the DoT is of the same strength or weaker you want to take full advantage of Pandemic to maximize uptime, but when its not you want to wait to let the stronger ticks tick out a bit.
Parna wrote:Yo guys! Two simple quest:
- When i'm pulling in prowl for glyph of savage roar proc is it better start with shred or rake?
- During normal rotation if i applied a dot with TF 15% AP buff and Haromm or AoC proc, it's still better TF buff or trinkets ones?
Shred is a little better at 90. Rake becomes better once you get the Improved Rake perk.
The two bleeds will do the same damage if they're both applied with TF (and Savage Roar).
Steakbomb wrote:No matter how you gear or gem, the biggest difference in actual dps output really is uptime on the boss. Last night when I was testing Aggixx's WAs for him we were comparing dmg breakdowns on Garrosh and the main difference in our dmg output was FB damage and most of that was his uptime on TeD of 33%(or close to that) and my uptime of Harrom's of 15% which equated to his FB dmg avg being 33k and mine being 26k.

Seems that at level 90, feral DPS is all about trinket procs and using those procs well to get off some FBs that are going to hit hard.
It was 23.7% which is a little above average, and yours was a little below average. I also have 39 more AP than you do (plus a little bit more since I was using Cata consumables).

@Simbba: Cloak can be changed to crit/haste but otherwise looks good. I use WA to track AoC ICD but I can't share my aura because of the way I have it setup, maybe someone else has one they can share.

@Raysere: Leather Specialization gives you 5% stats assuming they haven't removed that. I'll do a lookthrough of the enchants changes this evening and update the guide if needed.
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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide & FAQ -- Updated for 6.0!

Post by Raysere » Thu Oct 16, 2014 1:41 pm

aggixx wrote:@Raysere: Leather Specialization gives you 5% stats assuming they haven't removed that. I'll do a lookthrough of the enchants changes this evening and update the guide if needed.
That's it. I knew it was something like that. Numbers make sense now. Cheers.

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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide & FAQ -- Updated for 6.0!

Post by Chernobylec » Thu Oct 16, 2014 1:53 pm

Could you clarify for me a @[email protected] How does it work?

As far as i understand it means: If you get a proc of any trinket you have to reapply your bleeds immediately (I've used this before 6.0), but now it has gone and only TF and SoR influence on bleeds dmg, am I right?

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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide & FAQ -- Updated for 6.0!

Post by aggixx » Thu Oct 16, 2014 2:21 pm

As far as I can tell you've got the right idea, but if there's something specific that isn't clear to you from how its explained in the guide let me know so I can consider revising it.
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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide & FAQ -- Updated for 6.0!

Post by poekai » Thu Oct 16, 2014 3:31 pm

I have a question on snapshotting for RIP.

The guide says that updating rip with TF under 25 percent is the goal so that it rolls.

What about updating a rip but was not placed on the target with TF outside of sub 25 percent?. Is it worth it to reapply it, or wait till it ticks down and TF comes back up again?

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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide & FAQ -- Updated for 6.0!

Post by Cetlysm » Thu Oct 16, 2014 4:21 pm

poekai wrote:I have a question on snapshotting for RIP.

The guide says that updating rip with TF under 25 percent is the goal so that it rolls.

What about updating a rip but was not placed on the target with TF outside of sub 25 percent?. Is it worth it to reapply it, or wait till it ticks down and TF comes back up again?
To me it looks like its only worth reapplying if that rip will benefit from pandemic, otherwise a FB will be better.

The hard question is, is it worth waiting for rip to reach pandemic threshold (assuming its really close to it) before you pop TF or even under TF?
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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide & FAQ -- Updated for 6.0!

Post by Alteredbeast » Thu Oct 16, 2014 5:42 pm

Steakbomb wrote:No matter how you gear or gem, the biggest difference in actual dps output really is uptime on the boss. Last night when I was testing Aggixx's WAs for him we were comparing dmg breakdowns on Garrosh and the main difference in our dmg output was FB damage and most of that was his uptime on TeD of 33%(or close to that) and my uptime of Harrom's of 15% which equated to his FB dmg avg being 33k and mine being 26k.

Seems that at level 90, feral DPS is all about trinket procs and using those procs well to get off some FBs that are going to hit hard.
Can you tell me what you guys were averaging for overall dps on the Mythic Garrosh encounter? We killed him last night and I'm just going through logs to see where I can improve. Single target felt pretty smooth although I see a few spots I can improve. Not a big fan of tab raking.... We had quite a few attempt on him for me to pick through as we were fighting the patch bug boss more then anything, (between DC's and him casting Malice on people not in the room...)
I was avg about 15k dps across most of the pulls and 1400 hps (DoC with HT macro'd to heal the bosses target).

What kind of numbers are you pros pulling?
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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide & FAQ -- Updated for 6.0!

Post by aggixx » Thu Oct 16, 2014 5:54 pm

Cetlysm wrote:To me it looks like its only worth reapplying if that rip will benefit from pandemic, otherwise a FB will be better.

The hard question is, is it worth waiting for rip to reach pandemic threshold (assuming its really close to it) before you pop TF or even under TF?
In general, you don't want to waste duration refreshing a Rip except for the sub-25% thing. If you can put up a stronger Rip, then you want to do it as soon after 7.2 seconds as possible.

Usually if you're asking a question of "should I delay TF?" the answer is no; in that case specifically you probably want to Bite or SR, then TF. At level 90 you should have absolutely zero issues getting to 5 CP during that TF to apply a Rip anyway.

The last question is complicated but I think it boils down to:
If you can bite and still have time to Rip after it (very possible with the 4pc) then that's clearly the best option.
Otherwise your choices are to apply immediately and then shred, or to wait. Clipping the Rip early means you waste 2 or 3 seconds of Rip which is a waste of roughly 0.5 combo points (2.5/24*5), and waiting is a waste of (at least) 15% of a shred's damage.

Take some numbers from SimC (looking at simulation max values to make sure its done with 50 energy FB), 0.5 combo points converts into about 4150 damage via FB (accounting for the energy costs) and 15% of a shred is about 2,747 damage. So the difference is pretty negligible. If waiting prevents you from shredding more than once its worse, otherwise its better.

Edit: Fixed some maths.
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