Crazy T13 2P Idea

Felucia · Post by **Felucia** » Fri Sep 06, 2013 1:18 am

Hello fellow kittens

So, I was talking to a feral friend of mine when we thought about the T13 2p setbonus.

(2) Set: Feral: Ferocious Bite now refreshes the duration of your Rip on targets with 60% or less health.

Long story short: Would it be worth it to exchange two pieces of gear (gloves and shoulders as the others have more stats) for that bonus? I can give you some stats + I've changed the pieces on my own gear in Catus. However I have no idea how to do the maths x)

Our thought process was, If we could apply a big Rip at 60% and keep it up till the boss dies, it could be worth it(thinking single target, ra'den/durumu/jikun/jinrokh/iron qon(?)/..., currently).

This is my gear with shoulders and gloves replaced with t13:
i changed the sockets to lower ones, the enchants however i did not change.

Spoiler: show

I am losing 2200 agility (with HotW) and about 3600 mastery while rune is active, reducing the proc to 30000.
I would certainly run DoC in this scenario, tho.

What are your thoughts?

Best greetings,

aggixx · Post by **aggixx** » Fri Sep 06, 2013 2:05 am

I'm skeptical that it would be a gain, you lose SO much stats from 2 pieces. Most fights you wouldn't be able to keep the same rip up indefinitely anyway.

Stenhaldi · Post by **Stenhaldi** » Fri Sep 06, 2013 3:55 am

Yeah, I considered this a while back and decided it wasn't worth it. Extremely rough napkinmath, but the stat and 4-piece loss is worth something like 15% overall damage, and in exchange you extend execute phase for an extra ~35% of the fight. Execute phase damage depends a lot on proc luck, but as one estimate, simulationcraft me does ~11% more damage in execute phase than otherwise. This leads to a measly (.4+.6*1.11)/(.75+.25*1.11)-1 = 4% damage increase -- no compensation at all. I'm fairly certain I can play my trinket procs better than the simculationcraft action list does (which would lead to a better execute rip), but consider even the ideal scenario: you get both trinkets stacked and end up with a execute rip at, say, quadruple normal strength. If rip is ~25% of pre-execute damage and its average strength pre-execute is already ~1.7 times base strength (seems about right looking at logs), then under this circumstance, execute damage is .25*(4/1.7-1) = 34% above normal damage. Yet even in this ideal scenario, the set bonus is only picking up (.4+.6*1.34)/(.75+.25*1.34)-1 = 11% overall damage, still not enough to compensate the loss. (You'll pick up some ferocious bites too, but not 6% overall damage worth -- and this scenario was still far more ideal than what you'd normally see.)

Sibylle · Post by **Sibylle** » Fri Sep 06, 2013 3:57 am

That was my favourite set bonus, ever

Shame it isn't viable.

raffy · Post by **raffy** » Fri Sep 06, 2013 4:59 am

If curious, I've added the T13 bonuses to the next update of Catus (not released yet), and made all of the action logic uses "bitw" rather than "25%" so it adjusts accordingly, but I agree with the above assessments, the stat loss is hard to swallow.

aggixx · Post by **aggixx** » Fri Sep 06, 2013 4:26 pm

Stenhaldi wrote:Yeah, I considered this a while back and decided it wasn't worth it. Extremely rough napkinmath, but the stat and 4-piece loss is worth something like 15% overall damage, and in exchange you extend execute phase for an extra ~35% of the fight. Execute phase damage depends a lot on proc luck, but as one estimate, simulationcraft me does ~11% more damage in execute phase than otherwise. This leads to a measly (.4+.6*1.11)/(.75+.25*1.11)-1 = 4% damage increase -- no compensation at all. I'm fairly certain I can play my trinket procs better than the simculationcraft action list does (which would lead to a better execute rip), but consider even the ideal scenario: you get both trinkets stacked and end up with a execute rip at, say, quadruple normal strength. If rip is ~25% of pre-execute damage and its average strength pre-execute is already ~1.7 times base strength (seems about right looking at logs), then under this circumstance, execute damage is .25*(4/1.7-1) = 34% above normal damage. Yet even in this ideal scenario, the set bonus is only picking up (.4+.6*1.34)/(.75+.25*1.34)-1 = 11% overall damage, still not enough to compensate the loss. (You'll pick up some ferocious bites too, but not 6% overall damage worth -- and this scenario was still far more ideal than what you'd normally see.)

Yeah I did some even rougher calculations like this at the end of cata and pretty much got the same conclusion; maaaaybe if you got the best rip lineup ever it could sort of be worth it but overall it's a silly thing to do (of course that was when there was a lot less of a stat gap between the gear).

monopoly8 wrote:i think it would be very interesting to see perhaps on a single target fight, would be cool for like jin rokh though. lol

It could maybe work on Ji'kun but then you have the inability to get feathers ever again after you apply that rip, so the boss would have to die VERY fast. Perhaps it could work in a zerg where the boss dies shortly after you use your 3rd feather, but obviously that's at the point where you insanely outgear the encounter.

Tremnen · Post by **Tremnen** » Tue Sep 24, 2013 3:16 pm

with the recent rip buff... I am going to look into this again this afternoon. It might be really nice on like seige crafter, malkorok, Sha of Pride, Norushen,

Tremnen · Post by **Tremnen** » Wed Sep 25, 2013 1:40 am

Looks like its still fairly big dps loss on patchwerk

Felucia · Post by **Felucia** » Wed Sep 25, 2013 11:21 am

Tremnen wrote:Looks like its still fairly big dps loss on patchwerk

Welp, thanks anyway

The Fluid Druid

Crazy T13 2P Idea

Crazy T13 2P Idea

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