WoD Beta General Discussion

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Minibubble
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Re: WoD Beta General Discussion

Post by Minibubble » Fri Jul 25, 2014 6:09 pm

I dont want to be picky but im not impressed. The neck looks like snapped. I hope this is not the final form. It feels more like a new race than an enhanced form. I get it that they are from the jungle but they shouldnt be naked. Im half embarrassed.
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raffy
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Re: WoD Beta General Discussion

Post by raffy » Fri Jul 25, 2014 6:22 pm

Even if we're stuck with one talent for PvP, being a CC threat (off-target Maim, on-demand Clones in form) with decent heals (Rejuv, L90 talents) and the ability to target swap whenever we want is going to be awesome.

Moving SR to a glyph (with a penalty) is also a good change.
Minibubble wrote:I hope this is not the final form
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Re: WoD Beta General Discussion

Post by hullaballoonatic » Fri Jul 25, 2014 6:45 pm

I presume we can use Growl in CoS form, too?

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Re: WoD Beta General Discussion

Post by aggixx » Fri Jul 25, 2014 6:46 pm

No, you can't. You only meet the form requirements for spells that require Cat Form.

@raffy: I lol'd.
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hullaballoonatic
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Re: WoD Beta General Discussion

Post by hullaballoonatic » Fri Jul 25, 2014 8:00 pm

But it says in the tooltip ANY druid spell that doesn't deal damage. Growl is a non-damaging druid spell.

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Re: WoD Beta General Discussion

Post by Acornbrain » Fri Jul 25, 2014 8:49 pm

DoC vs CoS . . .

I am still trying to fully understand the new CoS talent but I seem to get more questions than answers as I evaluate. One of which is - is there an unintended link now between our L90 a& L100 Secondary Talents?

If one takes the L90 DoC why wouldn't one take the L100 BT? What advantage does CoS have over BT except buffing heals a bit at the expense of damage (depending on how the CoS 5% versatility works out)?

If one take the L100 CoS why wouldn't one take the L90 NV? What advantage does a DoC HT have over a CoS HT? A CoS HT can be cast at anytime, while a DoC HT one should wait for a PS buff. NV also does a little bit of damage,

Oh, these L90/L100 seems to make the L30 CW redundant, especially if one envelopes the abilities in focus macros. And here's a radical idea ... replace L30's CW with DoC as it is straight heals now and get us something new at L90?

Thoughts?

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Re: WoD Beta General Discussion

Post by hullaballoonatic » Fri Jul 25, 2014 8:51 pm

DoC and BT are actually unintuitively mutually counterproductive.

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Re: WoD Beta General Discussion

Post by Acornbrain » Fri Jul 25, 2014 9:17 pm

Why? They seem to me to be the MoP talent split into 2. What am I missing?

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Minibubble
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Re: WoD Beta General Discussion

Post by Minibubble » Fri Jul 25, 2014 9:35 pm

Also how would be HotW and CoS? Since Healers will be nerfed in WoD and they won't be able to keep everyone up at 100% do you think personal healing will be much more important? Do you think healing between low energy phases will be mandatory?
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Re: WoD Beta General Discussion

Post by Acornbrain » Fri Jul 25, 2014 9:50 pm

Minibubble, a big question that remains to be seen. However, I think we are strong here. Before Ysera's Gift came about I used to occasionally run with a focus macro on CW - heal my focus target (usually tank), or me if no focus. This can be done with HT too no matter which 90/100 combo taken. We can help out our healers even without Survival Instincts which looks very strong at the moment (without experiencing the new bosses). I am not sure that HotW is strong enough now without tranquility.

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Re: WoD Beta General Discussion

Post by aggixx » Sat Jul 26, 2014 2:38 am

Acornbrain wrote:Why? They seem to me to be the MoP talent split into 2. What am I missing?
The two parts of the MoP talent don't synergize either. The damage increase causes you to use your Healing Touches in a restricted fashion to do the most damage which means you're not able to use them when you want to, ergo more overhealing, which means the healing increase is less effective. WoD DoC affects rejuvenation now though, and that part is neither synergistic nor asynergistic with Bloodtalons.

Overall I'd say the level 90 and level 100 talents don't synergize with each other in any significant manner. You'll still use the best 90 talent for the situation regardless of which 100 talent you have, and vice versa.
Acornbrain wrote:I am not sure that HotW is strong enough now without tranquility.
I agree. Obviously if there's potential for you to tank something its a very viable but option, but for just supporting the raid via healing I'm not sold on it. Testing out the balance of the level 90 talents is actually something I'm really looking forward to for raid testing.
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Re: WoD Beta General Discussion

Post by raffy » Sat Jul 26, 2014 4:07 am

WTB 3 charges of BT per HT on a target different than yourself :)

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Re: WoD Beta General Discussion

Post by Teags » Sat Jul 26, 2014 4:35 am

This thread is exactly what I've been looking for ^^ people who understand when I talk "kitty"

I've been in beta for the last two weeks, was running sotf, doc and savagery due to it being the highest dps output personally. I wasn't that keen on using DoC part 2 (blood talons)

The level 100 talents they recently applied in the patch seem to just give us back what we had previously in two parts. The CoS is essentially what we lost from Mists HotW with the 5% damage increase in the form or versatility. Nice little bonus on the damage reduction included there though.

With Bloodtalons is anyone aware if this still effects the strength of bleeds? I understand they were getting rid of snapshotting, but this one no one seems to know the answer to :-/

I would throw my opinion in about the talents, but it's beta, and while not 100% original talents, why break what wasn't broken. ^^

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Re: WoD Beta General Discussion

Post by Dagzter » Sat Jul 26, 2014 5:40 am

Tweeted some early impressions of the model on beta this morning: I find the quasi-quadrapedal movement quite strange, but that could simply take some getting used to; skin is very basic, but that's to be expected at this stage; combat animations seems reasonable enough - I'd say visually/thematically 'feral', but strangely the whole feeling of the form has not struck me as particularly druid-like in the short time I have experimented with it.

Naturally will have to wait and see.

Complete tangent: anyone had difficulty with their macro modifiers in beta? L-Ctrl is simply not working for me :(

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Re: WoD Beta General Discussion

Post by Monopedia » Sat Jul 26, 2014 6:41 am

I'm quite happy with the model (the tail animation when running aside). It is the worgen skeleton, and the run animation is just the Running Wild worgen "mount" with decreased animation speed, its not perfect but I doubt it ever would be regardless of how it would end up.

CoS is clearly going to be the least of a damage increase but it is a damage increase over not having that talent at all. In addition the quality of life of being able to remove enrages (sooth) and dispel poisons/curses from yourself or others is amazing and whiel a lot of people will see it as "I am damage, I don't want utility talent" I think people are underestimating the power it can have in situations.

The entire talent row works well - you have the less complex active talent with Lunar Inspiration, fairly easy to pull off.
The more complex active talent in Blood Talons, can be difficult for some to master.
The Passive talent that has added benefits outside of damage with a slight focus towards PvP
As we know if you don't pull off DoC well enough then it can be an actual DPS loss to use that talent on live.

As for Lore/theme reasons for the talent, it is Troll druids who have been messing around with similar techniques the High Priests used in Zul'Gurub to become avatars of the troll Loa, but the druids are not exploiting it and are using their "natural" power alongside it. It is not all that forced to fit. The other Druid races are likely split in their opinion of its uses, frowning upon it I guess.

EDIT: I was having a few issues with macro modifiers last night, it turned out the modifier + key were already bound to some random action bar button that had no ability on it. Best to go through the keybindings to be sure

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Re: WoD Beta General Discussion

Post by Dagzter » Sat Jul 26, 2014 6:49 am

Ahh :) cheers Mono. It was, indeed, bound to something with no ability attached - can't believe I missed that! Too early in the morning.

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Re: WoD Beta General Discussion

Post by Untamable » Sat Jul 26, 2014 7:31 am

Now that Savagery is gone, what do you guys think about this:

Put CoS in lvl 90 talent row instead of DoC and take the 5% Ver away, and merge DoC with BT as lvl 100 talent.

but that would leave us with two lvl 100 talents xD
Thoughts?
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Re: WoD Beta General Discussion

Post by Minibubble » Sat Jul 26, 2014 7:49 am

Monopedia wrote:...
As for Lore/theme reasons for the talent, it is Troll druids who have been messing around with similar techniques the High Priests used in Zul'Gurub to become avatars of the troll Loa, but the druids are not exploiting it and are using their "natural" power alongside it. It is not all that forced to fit. The other Druid races are likely split in their opinion of its uses, frowning upon it I guess.
...
It gets confusing with the Worgen. They already had/have the Pack form and get banished in the Emerald Dream for it (Nelfs, not the Worgen). Now with the new form they should be allowied to use the Pack form instead of the Snow Leopard form. It would make sense lorewise.
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Re: WoD Beta General Discussion

Post by teddabear » Sat Jul 26, 2014 8:26 am

hullaballoonatic wrote:DoC and BT are actually unintuitively mutually counterproductive.
I disagree , make a macro to throw a rejuv on the tank and it's far more synergistic than it was in MoP. Especially with PS extended by 50%. In fact I'd say it is actually the most synergistic combo Feral has right now.

Seems like the players who wanted a passive SR for PvE really got hosed by the new change. CoS seems fairly useless for PvE so they just lost 5% off their damage. If they wanted passive SR you can be sure they will not be taking Bloody Talons. On the whole if Lunar Inspiration isn't very very good then Blizzard's attempt to make Feral more accessible is going to have the opposite effect.

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Re: WoD Beta General Discussion

Post by Meaningless » Sat Jul 26, 2014 8:49 am

teddabear wrote:
hullaballoonatic wrote:DoC and BT are actually unintuitively mutually counterproductive.
Seems like the players who wanted a passive SR for PvE really got hosed by the new change. CoS seems fairly useless for PvE so they just lost 5% off their damage. If they wanted passive SR you can be sure they will not be taking Bloody Talons. On the whole if Lunar Inspiration isn't very very good then Blizzard's attempt to make Feral more accessible is going to have the opposite effect.
I think people who were to pick savagery will most likely just go with CoS, people seems to forget that it actually gives you 5% versatility.

On a different note, is it confirmed that snapshotting will be removed in 6.0, or will they wait with it until WoD? (100% dmg increase on rake with snapshotting would be so much fun :D)

I know its too early to talk about dps considering nothing is balanced yet, but wouldn't botw make Bloodtalons really strong this expansion considering there is nothing else to snapshot with? (imagine another garrosh type encounter with lots of execute extending)
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Re: WoD Beta General Discussion

Post by aggixx » Sat Jul 26, 2014 1:53 pm

Teags wrote:With Bloodtalons is anyone aware if this still effects the strength of bleeds? I understand they were getting rid of snapshotting, but this one no one seems to know the answer to :-/
It's mechanically identical to live. Not that hard to test, really.
Untamable wrote:Now that Savagery is gone, what do you guys think about this:

Put CoS in lvl 90 talent row instead of DoC and take the 5% Ver away, and merge DoC with BT as lvl 100 talent.

but that would leave us with two lvl 100 talents xD
Thoughts?
No reason to do that, WoD DoC is not live DoC and merging it with Bloodtalons would make Bloodtalons very very strong. DoC is fine as a standalone talent.
teddabear wrote:I disagree , make a macro to throw a rejuv on the tank and it's far more synergistic than it was in MoP. Especially with PS extended by 50%. In fact I'd say it is actually the most synergistic combo Feral has right now.
There's no synergy there. You can put a rejuv on the tank without either talent, and with DoC you can put it on both you and the tank; taking Bloodtalons doesn't improve that in any way.
teddabear wrote:Seems like the players who wanted a passive SR for PvE really got hosed by the new change. CoS seems fairly useless for PvE so they just lost 5% off their damage. If they wanted passive SR you can be sure they will not be taking Bloody Talons. On the whole if Lunar Inspiration isn't very very good then Blizzard's attempt to make Feral more accessible is going to have the opposite effect.
Nope, the players who were going to use Savagery are pretty much now indisputably better off. They do about the same damage with CoS + GoS as they would've with Savagery talent, but now they have 2.5% damage reduction, 5% increased healing, and the ability to cast non-damaging spells in form. The only thing they lost is a glyph slot but being able to do all that is certainly worth 1 glyph slot.
Meaningless wrote:On a different note, is it confirmed that snapshotting will be removed in 6.0, or will they wait with it until WoD? (100% dmg increase on rake with snapshotting would be so much fun :D)

I know its too early to talk about dps considering nothing is balanced yet, but wouldn't botw make Bloodtalons really strong this expansion considering there is nothing else to snapshot with? (imagine another garrosh type encounter with lots of execute extending)
WoD mechanics will become active in 6.0, but I think you have a misunderstanding of what the snapshotting change means. Things like the rake perk still snapshot because by they have to in order to work: it increases all damage of the rake by 100%, not just the direct damage. BitW still maintains snapshots and while its a nice bonus its not overly strong.
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Re: WoD Beta General Discussion

Post by Minibubble » Sat Jul 26, 2014 2:03 pm

Did someone of you join the raid event on Beta? If so what was your impression? Didnt find any good feedback about it. How is healing? Do selfheal i.e. HT, Yasera have more impact on overall healing? I hope so, i love the idea that we have blurry lines between the 3 rolls.
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Re: WoD Beta General Discussion

Post by aggixx » Sat Jul 26, 2014 2:15 pm

While I tried to participate in both Butcher and Gruul the servers were so unstable that I only got 4 pulls on Gruul and it wasn't really enough to say much. I was on a less than ideal character so I spent just as much time setting up binds and stuff instead of thinking about the encounter. Sten or someone else might have enough experience to comment, but for the most part a lot of the testing is ruined by the fact we have a couple bugs that cause our rotation to end up a bit different from what it should be.
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Re: WoD Beta General Discussion

Post by teddabear » Sat Jul 26, 2014 2:19 pm

aggixx wrote: Nope, the players who were going to use Savagery are pretty much now indisputably better off. They do about the same damage with CoS + GoS as they would've with Savagery talent, but now they have 2.5% damage reduction, 5% increased healing, and the ability to cast non-damaging spells in form. The only thing they lost is a glyph slot but being able to do all that is certainly worth 1 glyph slot.
I was under the impression 5% versatilty will be nowhere near 5% DPS. What is the intended value?

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Re: WoD Beta General Discussion

Post by aggixx » Sat Jul 26, 2014 2:22 pm

5% versatility is 5% DPS, but its better than the 5% from Savagery because its modifying a smaller base than the 140% of Savage Roar (102%ish depending on how much versatility you have on gear).
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