2 Questions

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Aerothane
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2 Questions

Post by Aerothane » Sat Aug 02, 2014 1:26 am

1st
Is regarding bleeds, so lets say the target has a rip on them and the rip I would apply would be 50% less than that currently on the target because the 1 first applied had rune+HT+TF+DoC+SR and the rip I would currently apply would only have DoC+SR+HT and is say worth 50%. However the rip currently on the target has 8 and HT's proc wears off in 2 seconds and I am at 60 energy, would it be a dps increase to apply it at the last second right before HT's proc wears off? And would the same apply to rake?

2nd
With Force of Nature when I am running it am I supposed to wait a HT proc all the way through (since it has no GCD,) and rune could proc after you've done so. Or is it based off at 3 doing this, or am I supposed to be using 1 currently and then saving 2 / possible 3 dependent on the cool down for Rune/HT proc? (what I am currently doing?)

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Kraineth
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Re: 2 Questions

Post by Kraineth » Sat Aug 02, 2014 3:08 am

1. An interesting question, and the core of the complexity of feral snapshotting. (This is assuming you mean 8 seconds after all extensions have been used) If you do apply it and don't get a Rune or HT proc over most of it's entire duration, it is probably a dps increase, unless you can get a TF+DoC Rip up right as the HT+Rune+DoC+TF Rip falls off. Under usual circumstances I would just let the original Rip tick off, since Rune+HT both have pretty good proc rates, I would rather not be kicking myself in the head if I overwrote that Rip and then Rune or HT proc right after. But it is always a gamble since RPPM trinkets are so random and you may not see another proc for over a minute. Anything under 6 seconds and I would overwrite the Rip for sure, but 8 seconds is pretty much a toss-up.

2. Generally wait, the only thing you miss out by not using it as soon as it procs is the increased melee damage from the treants since their rake snapshots but their melee damage is updated dynamically. But their melee damage is pretty low anyways. I would always just wait and see if you get a lucky rune proc.

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raffy
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Re: 2 Questions

Post by raffy » Sat Aug 02, 2014 3:56 am

For the curious: the Catus recommendation for FoN can be found here: http://fluiddruid.net/forum/viewtopic.p ... 634#p22621

Setup Catus, make sure FoN talent is selected, and then [alt]+click (FoN) under "Computable Statistics". Catus will reveal the internal threshold it is using to trigger FoN (This number is determined via simulation, see link above.) Then re-click the (FoN) button again to find where that damage lands among your possible FoN damage outputs.
See example: http://fluiddruid.net/forum/viewtopic.p ... 860#p21601

Triggering details: http://fluiddruid.net/forum/viewtopic.p ... 233#p19233

Reposting my disclaimer:
FoN use in Catus is pretty smart and often appears as a DPS gain. However, it's very difficult emulate this performance in-game without considerable effort. The biggest problem being the damage loss caused by a few poorly executed trees typically makes SotF better. Additionally, the trees occasionally act really dumb in-game. With the WarcraftLogs simulator, it would be interesting to compare human FoN use to Catus.

Aerothane
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Re: 2 Questions

Post by Aerothane » Sat Aug 02, 2014 2:45 pm

In response to question 1

How it seems to me is since the weakauras does it in a percent form, it would make since to over write a rip if that rip is say 70% less than that which is currently on the target and its duration (extended) has occurred for 30% of its time applied and there is some affect you are snap shooting such as trinkets which would lead to a dps gain, is this correct?

Also has anyone ever had the 4 peice proc and then suddenly done a 3 combo point rip accidentally, is there a way to prevent this or is this just something that happens when you miss click?

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Cetlysm
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Re: 2 Questions

Post by Cetlysm » Sat Aug 02, 2014 4:24 pm

For the sake of different answers I didn't read the other replies.

I would't apply a new rip if I happened fo be in your shoes OP.
Haromm is too small, when compared to double trinket fully buffed rip, its not even 1/3.

I would pool energy to 90~ and FB, or thrash and then pool energy to FB.
If it was only a rune with DoC I would wait for the decimals on rune and then overwritte.


For FoN you should only use them on rune procs, right at the end of the proc.
But never let the CD cap, if youre at 2 charges and 3rd charge is near refreshing but no trinkets are procing, use a treant just so you don't cap.

About the set4 question, try messing with the lag tolerance, I also sometimes spam rip when I barely reached 5cp with rune up and the only way to get the rip of in time is go spam and hope for a life aving OoC proc, but I've never had the set 4 screw me over
Rarely happens to me when rune procs right after finishers and I made the mistake of not looking into the future with my crystal ball, and not pooling energy.
Last edited by Cetlysm on Sat Aug 02, 2014 11:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Closure
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Re: 2 Questions

Post by Closure » Sat Aug 02, 2014 8:55 pm

I have a question also its sort of similar so ill just ask in this rather than starting new thread.

How do you guys get a 5 point rip up with DoC I am having a lot of problems getting 5 point rips up with the buff.
Lets say I get a 1 point rip up which I do now often bc im bad during RoR with DoC and then I build up to 5combo the
weakauras still tell me that the DoC RoR 1pt rip is stronger than the RoR 5pt rip.

Any tips other than stop being bad? I think this is why my DPS fluctuates quite a bit pull to pull

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Cetlysm
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Re: 2 Questions

Post by Cetlysm » Sat Aug 02, 2014 11:13 pm

Stenhaldi's weakauras calculates the ratios like if every rip is at 5cp as far as I know.
As for getting DoC with 5cp rip, just use PS when at 4-5cp, that's really I can say, if you're having trouble with that you need better gear or SotF if you're not spec into it, also using mangle more and pooling a bit of energy before a finisher is a good idea, specially if that finisher is FB.
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aggixx
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Re: 2 Questions

Post by aggixx » Mon Aug 04, 2014 2:23 pm

The WeakAura assumes the new rip will be 5 CP, but if you apply one at less than that it does take it into account when comparing to a new one.

And what Cetlysm said pretty much, aside from using the HT at the right time, the key is managing your energy. When you reach 5 CP you should evaluate if you need to spend them immediately, and if you don't you can (and should) wait for your energy bar to fill a bit that way you have a bit of a headstart in energy for your next PS proc.
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