Dps on heroic garrosh

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strayed
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Dps on heroic garrosh

Post by strayed » Mon Aug 25, 2014 10:41 am

Hi, may I know what are the average dps on heroic garrosh for kitties?

I know it won't be accurate because of the P1 adds and difference in strategy but as the world of logs doesn't have a record of it. I will like some numbers to check if I'm on track.

Our raid group is missing the dps to push Garrosh to P4 despite the higher ilvl than we have compared to the guilds that had done this before the ilvl upgrade.

Also if you can add the talents you ran while doing so, that will be great. :)

Muakkis
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Re: Dps on heroic garrosh

Post by Muakkis » Mon Aug 25, 2014 11:31 am

Hello Strayed,

Our guild formed 25man group and was able to get in as kitty. We are also currently in Garrosh so I can post some of my logs for your reference. I'm still learning kitty, having switched from MW monk and being inactive from 5.2 to 5.4 with my druid.

I'm logging them only on warcraft logs since I think their website provides better user interface and is cleaner to look at.

Thursdays raid
Sundays raid

I personally saw a bit of a improvement when using thrash on opener and trying to maintain it as much as possible. I didn't bother re applying it when the first adds came just because I think having trinket thrash on Garrosh is a lot more valuable than the add damage.
Might be a bit offtopic or thread stealing, but any critique is welcome!

Wellwow
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Re: Dps on heroic garrosh

Post by Wellwow » Mon Aug 25, 2014 11:40 am

I highly recommend checking out warcraftlogs.com.

Take a look at the feral rankings on the fight.

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Cetlysm
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Re: Dps on heroic garrosh

Post by Cetlysm » Mon Aug 25, 2014 12:05 pm

Fight has 2 very important long execute range periods which dictate your damage based on rng procs, I've gone from 450k to 600k (which later got ruined by broken logs) and anything in between.

Only thing you can do to push to p4 faster as feral is snapshotting a pretty good rip and having strong warriors that can solo the MC with bladestorm.
To push p2 faster you could try hotw vengeance trick.
Last edited by Cetlysm on Mon Aug 25, 2014 12:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Muakkis
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Re: Dps on heroic garrosh

Post by Muakkis » Mon Aug 25, 2014 12:26 pm

Cetlysm wrote:To push p2 faster you could try hotw vengeance trick.
Could you open that a bit more.
Do you mean taunting Garrosh and getting some vengeance and dpsing in bear from for 20 second?

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Meaningless
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Re: Dps on heroic garrosh

Post by Meaningless » Mon Aug 25, 2014 12:45 pm

Muakkis wrote:
Cetlysm wrote:To push p2 faster you could try hotw vengeance trick.
Could you open that a bit more.
Do you mean taunting Garrosh and getting some vengeance and dpsing in bear from for 20 second?
In the first transition, pop hotw and go into bear form, pop dispersion and soak 2 annihilations, pop ursoc and Survival Insticts and keep soaking while hitting the boss, when Survival Insticts drops pop barskin and call for an external cd (pref pain suppression). If you don't have a priest for symb, just do the rest and ignore the first 2 waves.
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Cetlysm
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Re: Dps on heroic garrosh

Post by Cetlysm » Mon Aug 25, 2014 12:46 pm

a hand of salvation is also never a bad idea, specially if you have tanks that for some reason don't soak annihilates for vengeance.

oh and make sure you have the 50% less dmg taken debuff or you're gonna splat
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Alteredbeast
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Re: Dps on heroic garrosh

Post by Alteredbeast » Mon Aug 25, 2014 1:38 pm

We have 4 ferals in our 25 man and I'd say 400k is a pretty good benchmark. None of us ever focuses on adds unless a wolf rider doesn't get 1/2 his hp knocked off by the iron star. If you get an incidental thrash off on the adds, great... but you should never thrash the adds if it costs you Garrosh Damage.

DoC and typhoon are really the only talent choices I can think that I utilize. Disorienting Roar too I guess for the first few MC's, but haven't actually needed that in so long as they get broken out so fast.
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Meaningless
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Re: Dps on heroic garrosh

Post by Meaningless » Mon Aug 25, 2014 2:44 pm

You'll do way more damage with the hotw vengeance trick than you will with DoC.
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Rayen
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Re: Dps on heroic garrosh

Post by Rayen » Mon Aug 25, 2014 3:10 pm

Meaningless wrote:You'll do way more damage with the hotw vengeance trick than you will with DoC.
While this is true...raid leaders and healers tend to frown on doing this...even if you tell them ahead of time. Been lectured more than once about taking "Unnecessary" damage, despite using CD's and keeping myself up. So depends on the raid-some will let you do it-others will foam at the mouth and rage if you do.

Then again I have stupid fellow melee that like to pop a bubble on me to try to mess up my opener. Thank god for cancel aura macros.
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Mooninites
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Re: Dps on heroic garrosh

Post by Mooninites » Mon Aug 25, 2014 4:06 pm

Wellwow wrote:I highly recommend checking out warcraftlogs.com.

Take a look at the feral rankings on the fight.

I think thats a pretty poor way to measure your dps, especially this late in the expansion. A lot of people have fully upgraded heroic or even heroic warforged gear and really are just raiding for personal records. People are a lot more prone to cheese it, especially if it's been on farm than OP, who I'm assuming is on Heroic Garrosh as progression rather than farm content(?)

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Untamable
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Re: Dps on heroic garrosh

Post by Untamable » Mon Aug 25, 2014 5:26 pm

Wellwow wrote:I highly recommend checking out warcraftlogs.com.

Take a look at the feral rankings on the fight.
oh look! I see my name there :P


anyways, as other have said, your dps will be determined on the rips you get during the execute phases. The HoTW trick is nice, but if you mess it up your damage will be screwed.

I personally prefer to go with DoC and I have been doing fine with it.

Good luck!!
Name changed to Purr
Proraiders

strayed
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Re: Dps on heroic garrosh

Post by strayed » Tue Aug 26, 2014 1:52 am

Thanks for all the replies and help. I will check out warcraftlogs.com, didn't know there's still one that works.

As for the gear, I am fully upgraded heroic but they are not all BiS and I don't have a RoRo (still praying for a drop). Running Harrom's and AoC.

I am doing a 10 man heroic and we have no warriors unfortunately. I was also wondering if treants or sotf will be better? Sometimes with the strategy we are running, I tend to forget dropping treants but treants yield a definite higher dps if I utilize them correctly.

As for the bear vengeance trick, I think it is too much to handle at the moment. As our strategy has too much going on for me to pull the vengeance trick off properly and I need the defensive cooldowns later for whirling. Thanks for the tip and explanation though.

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Meaningless
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Re: Dps on heroic garrosh

Post by Meaningless » Tue Aug 26, 2014 7:38 am

If you are already running with DoC I'd stick to SotF, as far as treants goes without RoRo, I'm not exactly sure how well it fairs..
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Muakkis
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Re: Dps on heroic garrosh

Post by Muakkis » Tue Aug 26, 2014 5:21 pm

Today I got to test the vengeance trick and I must say that I adds a lot of dps compared to what I have to do. I got always 1 pain suppression and sometimes other defensives also and was able to go up on boss damage sky rocketing. It took some tries to get used to since I wasn't 100% sure how I would do it, but once I got it to work I must say it worked magnificently.

Still wasn't able to kill the boss :(

If someone wants logs or VODs for some reason I can add them later on.

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Stenhaldi
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Re: Dps on heroic garrosh

Post by Stenhaldi » Fri Aug 29, 2014 11:01 pm

Here's an example video of the HotW vengeance trick. Dispersion 2 hits, Survival Instincts 4, and then barkskin+glyphed might of ursoc the next 4 (also need ancestral vigor or an external cooldown to survive here). No external healing is needed -- you heal yourself fully with frenzied regeneration after each hit.

strayed
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Re: Dps on heroic garrosh

Post by strayed » Tue Sep 02, 2014 12:42 pm

Improved my dps and Rune (say it with me...RUNE) just dropped for me today! (Time to test it tomorrow :D)

I'm looking into the vengeance trick now because we are barely making the dps check to p4 and it is still very tight. Giving us little to no way to practice it.

I tried it in normal 25man Garrosh and survived fine up till the part where I ran out of SI.

I'm wondering if a glyphed might of ursoc is needed for this as I am running a stampeding roar glyph for my other raid members and the cat form and SR glyph is pretty much needed.

Also, what is the dps rotation when you get into hotw bear? Is it like thrash + 3 lacerate then spamming of maul + mangle?

Thanks for all the help!

Evabi
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Re: Dps on heroic garrosh

Post by Evabi » Tue Sep 02, 2014 1:10 pm

Hey there,

We've been farming Heroic Garrosh for 4 Weeks now. Here are my logs for comparison: http://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/g98 ... target=165

I didn't know about the vengeance trick until I read this thread a few minutes ago.

I died this week during transition due to someone missing interrupts, but I still did better than previous weeks. On the logs linked, I was using TED and Harrom's.

The week before last I was using TED and AoC. The two weeks before that I was using RoRo and AoC.

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Stenhaldi
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Re: Dps on heroic garrosh

Post by Stenhaldi » Tue Sep 02, 2014 8:25 pm

strayed wrote:I'm looking into the vengeance trick now because we are barely making the dps check to p4 and it is still very tight. Giving us little to no way to practice it.

I tried it in normal 25man Garrosh and survived fine up till the part where I ran out of SI.

I'm wondering if a glyphed might of ursoc is needed for this as I am running a stampeding roar glyph for my other raid members and the cat form and SR glyph is pretty much needed.

Also, what is the dps rotation when you get into hotw bear? Is it like thrash + 3 lacerate then spamming of maul + mangle?
You need glyphed might of ursoc, and even then you'll need ancestral vigor (from getting healed by resto shamans) on top of it. If you don't want to glyph it, or if you want to play safe, you should only soak 6 hits (2 with dispersion and 4 with survival instincts) and then stop soaking (but still stay in bear form until your vengeance expires). You can also survive without glyphing it if you get an external cooldown.

Also, make sure you're casting survival instincts (or barkskin) right before the first hit you're going to eat with it, because 12 seconds is barely enough to cover 4 hits.

The damage rotation is basically the same as guardian druid. Priority is thrash (if thrash is down) > mangle > lacerate > faerie fire > thrash, but due to lacerate's cooldown, you usually want to execute a cycle like

mangle - lacerate - thrash or faerie fire - lacerate - repeat.

You can cast some mauls, but make sure you're leaving enough rage to heal yourself with frenzied regeneration. You want to stay in bear form until your vengeance expires (20 seconds after the last annihilate). Make sure you refresh thrash and lacerate before vengeance expires and make sure you don't recast them afterward. (If you want to track lacerate/thrash snapshots, you can use my guardian snapshot tracker if you like -- you'll just need to set it to load in feral spec as well. I don't bother with this though.) Also, I run force of nature on this fight and it's good to spend all of the charges at high vengeance.

With rune of re-origination, ideally you should have mastery > haste > crit so that you get mastery proc in cat form and haste proc in bear form. You might think crit would be better for bear form, but too much of it is wasted by exceeding 100%. A haste proc is still very strong.

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Cetlysm
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Re: Dps on heroic garrosh

Post by Cetlysm » Tue Sep 02, 2014 8:57 pm

Haste proc is strong because of the meta right?
They never removed haste affecting it?
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Stenhaldi
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Re: Dps on heroic garrosh

Post by Stenhaldi » Tue Sep 02, 2014 9:13 pm

Meta and cloak contribute a lot to its value, yeah.

teddabear
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Re: Dps on heroic garrosh

Post by teddabear » Sun Sep 28, 2014 6:59 pm

DPS should only be an issue on adds during transition. Most of the fight is mechanics.

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Re: Dps on heroic garrosh

Post by Athen » Mon Sep 29, 2014 9:05 am

Every Annihilate does 4200000 Damage. 3500000 first then 1700000 shortly after. So you have to get more than 4200000*0,8*0,5= 1680000 Hp with ursorcs and barkskin to soak every single annihilate in this phase by your own.
Its a safe way to get to around 700k vengeance in the end. But as Stenhaldi mentioned if you soak one annihilate with a delayed dispersion you reach much more vengeance after only one annihilate.At first it is a bit tricky to get the right timing but you can get used to it fast. Not only your veangence goes up to 1.3 million+ you don't have to 'waste' time in bear to ramp up vengeance and you don't have to play pingpong with your hp-bar. You simply Pop ALL cooldowns (besides Dispersion) before last annihilate and Dispersion right when you get hit. If it worked you stay in Bear do a ton of damage for 20 seconds and otherwise you switch back to cat.
In my guild it was every week a tortue to justify why i am 'risking' my live. So thank you for showing me that this is possible. Logs from my very first tries last week doing this: http://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/ygX ... &source=22

But another thing. At this high vengeance. It looked like i hit harder with lacerate initialy than with mangle. So i changed my normal priority to: Lacerate>mangle>trash with spamming maul (yeah i totaly forgot fearie fire). and refreshing lacerate and trash right before my vengeance expires. Maybe i am wrong there but for me it looked like if i focus on lacerate rather than mangle i do more damage total.

I am looking forward to fight garrosh every week because of this heartpumping CD management and its results ;)
If you have not tried this before do it this last week we are able to do so. You won't regret it!

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