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Is feral fun this expansion?

Posted: Sat Apr 22, 2017 9:38 pm
by Polihayse
It feels clunky compared to what I'm used to. It could just be my gear though.

Re: Is feral fun this expansion?

Posted: Sat Apr 22, 2017 10:53 pm
by ShmooDude
Not sure what you mean by clunky, but it is pretty high risk vs reward (relative to other classes) which iirc is what you advocated for in beta. Some things on the rotation that might not be obvious at first glance:

Ignore your pandemics and refresh Rip at <8-9, Rake at <7, and SR at <12-13. Pool energy when possible before using finishers.

Between JW reducing the duration of your bleeds and BT being buffed to 50%, snapshotting your Rake/Rip/AF is all that matters.

Rake is refreshed early because of limited BT charges (unless you have boots) and short duration requires you to refresh Rake basically every generator/finisher cycle.
Rip is refreshed early partially because of its low duration with JW and partially because the more you have a max duration Rip up, the higher your Ashamane's Bite uptime (thus the pooling before using your finisher to try for max duration after).
SR gets refreshed early because its duration is pretty low and if you don't, you'll end up combo point starved and your Rip uptimes will suffer.
Ferocious Bite (otherwise known as Ferocious Nibble) is rarely used outside of Berserk/execute because it hits for f' all damage (its about 1/4 the DPE of Rip and only marginally more than a shred) and is rarely worth throwing into the rotation (it needs to have a near 0 impact on your uptimes).

Once you know all that, its not so bad.


As far as fun, balance affinity is awesome. That extra 5 yards makes staying in melee infinitely easier. Main reason I stayed Feral.

Re: Is feral fun this expansion?

Posted: Sat Apr 22, 2017 11:12 pm
by zedinsky
That's probably because u quit during T18 and the feral set bonuses back then definitely didn't make us feel "clunky".

But on topic, feral has been really fun this expansion. We are very good at raids and dungeons. My guild pushed from world ranking 300~ to top50 this expansion and not once have I felt that I should be playing something else. No more of running that one cookiecutter talent setup for everything either (which drove me crazy in WOD), I've really had to think which talents I should run for each dungeon key and encounter.

You probably should tune into the FinalBossTV Legion Feral episode which is airing this Sunday for a more in-depth look.

https://twitter.com/FinalBossTV/status/ ... 5354735617

Re: Is feral fun this expansion?

Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 1:38 pm
by Polihayse
ShmooDude wrote:Not sure what you mean by clunky, but it is pretty high risk vs reward (relative to other classes) which iirc is what you advocated for in beta. Some things on the rotation that might not be obvious at first glance:

Ignore your pandemics and refresh Rip at <8-9, Rake at <7, and SR at <12-13. Pool energy when possible before using finishers.

Between JW reducing the duration of your bleeds and BT being buffed to 50%, snapshotting your Rake/Rip/AF is all that matters.

Rake is refreshed early because of limited BT charges (unless you have boots) and short duration requires you to refresh Rake basically every generator/finisher cycle.
Rip is refreshed early partially because of its low duration with JW and partially because the more you have a max duration Rip up, the higher your Ashamane's Bite uptime (thus the pooling before using your finisher to try for max duration after).
SR gets refreshed early because its duration is pretty low and if you don't, you'll end up combo point starved and your Rip uptimes will suffer.
Ferocious Bite (otherwise known as Ferocious Nibble) is rarely used outside of Berserk/execute because it hits for f' all damage (its about 1/4 the DPE of Rip and only marginally more than a shred) and is rarely worth throwing into the rotation (it needs to have a near 0 impact on your uptimes).

Once you know all that, its not so bad.


As far as fun, balance affinity is awesome. That extra 5 yards makes staying in melee infinitely easier. Main reason I stayed Feral.
My contention is that the spec looks poorly designed on the surface. I'm sure that if I look at it and learn more about it that I will learn some nuances about the spec that require skill, which of course would make the spec more fun from my perspective, but this is the case for every spec in the game. The thing is though that, after playing warrior and windwalker monk, it seems like dot-focused specs have no place in this game. This seems like a major shortcoming, and I get the impression that I would get more frustration than enjoyment from playing it.

Also, if it is going to be high risk, then it has to be high reward. I look at warcraftlogs and there is no evidence of high risk actually being rewarded.

Re: Is feral fun this expansion?

Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 2:18 pm
by Polihayse
Does Ashamane's Bite proc from Thrash with the set bonus?

Re: Is feral fun this expansion?

Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 2:49 pm
by ShmooDude
Polihayse wrote:My contention is that the spec looks poorly designed on the surface. I'm sure that if I look at it and learn more about it that I will learn some nuances about the spec that require skill, which of course would make the spec more fun from my perspective, but this is the case for every spec in the game. The thing is though that, after playing warrior and windwalker monk, it seems like dot-focused specs have no place in this game. This seems like a major shortcoming, and I get the impression that I would get more frustration than enjoyment from playing it.
It's almost entirely the same spec it was in wod, with shorter timers and more emphasis on snapshotting. You just don't have the set bonuses giving you crazy energy anymore.

As far as DoTs, I remember debating you back when we were much stronger DD back in the beta. You were arguing that bleeds don't matter enough because they weren't significantly higher DPE than the DD abilities and so differences in uptimes aren't as important. So Blizzard pushed us from "bleeds don't matter enough" to "only bleeds matter." It feels more than a little ironic that you're now saying DoTs suck.

Sorry if this sounds like an attack. I harbor more than a little resentment towards Blizzard's (imo) knee jerk switching of our damage breakdown at the end of the beta. They went from one end of the spectrum to the extreme other. Without the set bonus, shred is basically that thing you do between Rakes so you don't lose your BT snapshot.
Polihayse wrote:Also, if it is going to be high risk, then it has to be high reward. I look at warcraftlogs and there is no evidence of high risk actually being rewarded.
Risk vs reward ONLY counts within the spec (ie talents). Blizz came out and said so. They WILL NOT make a harder to play class do more DPS because they're harder to play. They've implied this before, though until now haven't said it so explicit.
Blizzard wrote:We don't want to make Feral overpowered in single-target just because the priority rotation is more complex.
Polihayse wrote:Does Ashamane's Bite proc from Thrash with the set bonus?
Yes

Re: Is feral fun this expansion?

Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 3:22 pm
by Polihayse
ShmooDude wrote:As far as DoTs, I remember debating you back when we were much stronger DD back in the beta. You were arguing that bleeds don't matter enough because they weren't significantly higher DPE than the DD abilities and so differences in uptimes aren't as important. So Blizzard pushed us from "bleeds don't matter enough" to "only bleeds matter." It feels more than a little ironic that you're now saying DoTs suck.
I agree that dots should count for most of the damage because that is the main theme of the spec. However, there is more to it than just the ratios of damage.

I'm sure that there is a way to do dots right, but this would require a lot of work. The amount of work that is required is more than what Blizzard is willing to spend designing it. I'm not against the idea of dots, but the way it is implemented is terrible. After discussing this stuff on the beta forum for a while, I came to the conclusion that feral simply needed a rework because the amount of effort required to fix it can't be expected to happen. I made a post on the beta feedback thread about this, but unfortunately it is deleted now.

Re: Is feral fun this expansion?

Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 6:38 pm
by Polihayse
Well I missed the final boss thing because I was doing yard work. Can't watch it because it's only available to subscribers.

Re: Is feral fun this expansion?

Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 8:08 pm
by Istaro
Polihayse wrote:The thing is though that, after playing warrior and windwalker monk, it seems like dot-focused specs have no place in this game.
In theory DoTs have the counterbalancing advantage that you can continue to damage a boss that's gone unattackable, although the shorter DoT timers reduce the magnitude of that effect and encounter design doesn't incorporate much in the way of disengage periods these days :(.

And of course the advantage that they inherently must be tuned to give higher DPET than DD abilities and thus allow for big DPS jumps on sustained multitarget . . . although the shorter DoT timers hurt that too. Come to think of it Jagged Wounds, which I liked the sound of at first, is kinda insidious, because in exchange for shorter timers (a basically qualitative nerf), it promises more damage (a buff but only a quantitative one), but in practice since our damage is balanced around having that buff, it in a sense doesn't count as a buff.

Re: Is feral fun this expansion?

Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 9:18 pm
by Polihayse
Istaro wrote:
Polihayse wrote:The thing is though that, after playing warrior and windwalker monk, it seems like dot-focused specs have no place in this game.
In theory DoTs have the counterbalancing advantage that you can continue to damage a boss that's gone unattackable, although the shorter DoT timers reduce the magnitude of that effect and encounter design doesn't incorporate much in the way of disengage periods these days :(.

And of course the advantage that they inherently must be tuned to give higher DPET than DD abilities and thus allow for big DPS jumps on sustained multitarget . . . although the shorter DoT timers hurt that too. Come to think of it Jagged Wounds, which I liked the sound of at first, is kinda insidious, because in exchange for shorter timers (a basically qualitative nerf), it promises more damage (a buff but only a quantitative one), but in practice since our damage is balanced around having that buff, it in a sense doesn't count as a buff.
It would probably make more sense if bleeds did more damage initially and less over time. Like a reverse curse of agony. And maybe ferocious bite could act as a refresh to the bleed's damage. I had a lot of fun thinking of ideas for feral.

Re: Is feral fun this expansion?

Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 10:47 pm
by Nich
I think it's fun. I like it being one of the more complex specs in the game - that's why I play it, not because I expect to be top damage for the effort put in.

I think the real problem with JW is that it reduces the dot period and the dot duration. If it were just a reduction in period for a fixed duration like other dot class interactions with haste, it'd be a much different playstyle.

Re: Is feral fun this expansion?

Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 11:49 pm
by Polihayse
Nich wrote:I think it's fun. I like it being one of the more complex specs in the game - that's why I play it, not because I expect to be top damage for the effort put in.

I think the real problem with JW is that it reduces the dot period and the dot duration. If it were just a reduction in period for a fixed duration like other dot class interactions with haste, it'd be a much different playstyle.
I've heard the claim that feral is complex many times, and this statement just seems very misleading to me. You can point to figures that show that there is a larger gap between the top players and the average player, but what this means is that the average player can't mindlessly push buttons in a way that results in somewhat meaningful dps like other classes can. They also almost certainly don't know what snapshotting is. It's not because feral is hard. It's because the players are ignorant.

If feral is complex in any way, it is because the playstyle isn't what you are used to. This isn't complexity though. This is just being different.

Saying feral is more complex is like saying that walking up an escalator that goes in the wrong direction is more complex than walking up stairs. Walking up stairs is easy. However, if you don't know what an escalator is and you mindlessly walk up the wrong one, then it is hard. You just need to know what an escalator is and then it is easy again. Just go to the escalator that goes up.

Re: Is feral fun this expansion?

Posted: Mon Apr 24, 2017 12:48 am
by Nich
I'm the only person in my guild that voluntarily plays feral. Our bear would rather play his rogue or dk than as a cat, if we have too many tanks show up. The shadowpriests and affliction warlocks and balance druids all find it too complex. They've dealt with snapshotting in the past.

There's a level of unfamiliarity, sure.

But mostly it's just that there are so many things to track, while being in melee and not having a nice ranged far-off POV to help with mechanics. It's not just multiple buffs and debuffs, but multiple resource types, and not filling every single gcd no matter what.


I don't think it's so scary as to be un-fun, but I've been playing it for almost a decade. Other specs and classes have had complexity added to increase player engagement - I also remember the days of spamming 2 buttons in vanilla on many classes. I still don't find them as much fun as feral.

I don't really know what you mean by clunky, or what your gear level is, but a lot of specs - not all - are gear dependent to some degree. Feral without a base level of crit is pretty awful.

Re: Is feral fun this expansion?

Posted: Mon Apr 24, 2017 1:06 am
by ShmooDude
Polihayse wrote:I've heard the claim that feral is complex many times, and this statement just seems very misleading to me. You can point to figures that show that there is a larger gap between the top players and the average player, but what this means is that the average player can't mindlessly push buttons in a way that results in somewhat meaningful dps like other classes can. They also almost certainly don't know what snapshotting is. It's not because feral is hard. It's because the players are ignorant.

If feral is complex in any way, it is because the playstyle isn't what you are used to. This isn't complexity though. This is just being different.

Saying feral is more complex is like saying that walking up an escalator that goes in the wrong direction is more complex than walking up stairs. Walking up stairs is easy. However, if you don't know what an escalator is and you mindlessly walk up the wrong one, then it is hard. You just need to know what an escalator is and then it is easy again. Just go to the escalator that goes up.
To a significant number of players, maintaining Rake, Rip, SR and maybe Thrash, with short timers (10,16,24,10), limited resources (energy/cps) and snapshotting (Prowl/BT/TF/SR) IS complex. And we haven't even started on the nuances such as cooldowns, when to pool, maximizing Ashamane's Bite uptime, multi-target situations or raid mechanics. Just because you or I can execute it well doesn't make it not the case. Hell, our simcraft script takes twice as long as demonology which is also like twice or more times as long as nearly every other spec (might be other slow ones but anything I've run is basically light speed compared to feral). Granted, something that's complicated to a computer is not necessarily complicated to a human (like say walking).

Compare that to the simpler specs such as BM which is basically Dire Beast > Kill Command > Cobra Shot or Assassination Rogues who are basically Rupture > Envenom for finishers and Garrote > Kingsbane before or after Envenom > Mutilate for generators while haveing way more energy/combo Points. Now, granted, both specs have more than that, but Feral has significantly more things to worry about than either of those so by comparison, Feral is complex. Can you name me one other spec that is more or as complex as Feral? There might be, not familiar with every class but a large number of mythic raiders have told me they've tried Feral (at various points) and went "f' that, that's ridiculous" and moved on to something else.

I think a much more useful analogy would be weight lifting in terms of difficulty (which imo, is more important to the discussion than "complex"). Power lifters can bench press moderate weights all day long, but that doesn't mean its not difficult to someone that rarely or never works out. You're looking at that 200 lb barbell and saying, ah, that's easy, I could bench press that all day long (no idea if that's a good number, just kinda picked one based on a chart). And it is, to you. Some people are going, that's difficult, but doable and others are going, are you crazy? I can't even do that once. Remember, the skill base of the large majority of WoW players is much closer to the "Are you crazy?" bunch than the power lifters.

Re: Is feral fun this expansion?

Posted: Mon Apr 24, 2017 12:42 pm
by Ayleena
Coming from someone who isn't the best ever feral or isn't even close, but has been steadfastly doing it for 9 years, I'd say feral in and of itself is still about the same as it ever was complexity wise (depending on your legendaries... I'd say that's not even true if you don't have gloves, boots, or ring), we just aren't getting the reward for doing it perfectly. Up to WoD, if I had a great run at a boss, did everything right, I was mostly likely going to be top 3 on that fight. Now, if I do the same, I am lucky to be 8th. We are just getting blown away by easier specs, and the gap is getting is longer and longer as the expac continues, since we, as always, scale poorly.

Just my .02 from the mid-tier level of raiding.

Re: Is feral fun this expansion?

Posted: Mon Apr 24, 2017 7:44 pm
by Istaro
With no FFF, Mangle, facing requirements, or trinket snapshotting anymore, I haven't considered feral complex on single target for a while now (although probably some of that is that I haven't bothered to switch from SotF to SR for instances for over a month now—which could be said to indicate that feral can be simple if you want it to be—and I thank Ashamane I didn't get the gloves, because I'd hate those random CPs with a passion).

The shorter timers could even be said to make things simpler by meaning you don't have to worry about weaving in FB.

Multi-target is another matter; tab-DoTting is a pretty ridiculous paradigm for a melee class without autofacing, even without weaving in Thrash and SR and Regrowth.

Re: Is feral fun this expansion?

Posted: Mon Apr 24, 2017 10:41 pm
by ShmooDude
Istaro wrote:With no FFF, Mangle, facing requirements, or trinket snapshotting anymore, I haven't considered feral complex on single target for a while now (although probably some of that is that I haven't bothered to switch from SotF to SR for instances for over a month now—which could be said to indicate that feral can be simple if you want it to be—and I thank Ashamane I didn't get the gloves, because I'd hate those random CPs with a passion).

The shorter timers could even be said to make things simpler by meaning you don't have to worry about weaving in FB.

Multi-target is another matter; tab-DoTting is a pretty ridiculous paradigm for a melee class without autofacing, even without weaving in Thrash and SR and Regrowth.
Oh yeah, SotF vs. SR makes things significantly easier. You go from watching 2 finisher timers to 1, and gain like 1/3 more energy (15 RPS to 20 according to simcraft for me) that reduces your idle time from 30% to 6%. So you absolutely can make less complex by taking easier talents, but you lower your maximum DPS by doing so. Although interestingly it seems to be a lot closer than it used to be for me (898k for SR and 864k for SotF). I think because of Luffa + T19 4 piece helps it a lot relative to SR.

Re: Is feral fun this expansion?

Posted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 4:51 am
by Zarzul
The only thing i really dont like is when i have to clip a buffed dot OR worse, SR and RIP fall off , the Penalties is huge, tons of energy and 10 CP down the drain.

i know, i know just think ahead, but again to clip a SR/TF/BT buffed RIP, with lower buffed dot, tear my soul apart everytime, and sometimes u have to run out with debuff, or do an interrupt on a other mob.

Sometimes u minimax it to the very edge, boss is under 25%, u have ½ a sec to refresh you're full buffed RIP, and ure FB get blocked/parryed/missed....allways allways do it from behide....

Re: Is feral fun this expansion?

Posted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 5:44 am
by Whitepaw
The short answer is: No, it's not fun this expansion. I judge this objectively, based on how many people actually raid with the spec.

But if you analyse it further, you get this:

- Cookie cutter spec for raiding is with Savage Roar/JW/BT - which forces a play style where you don't have any big dps cool downs and where you basically refresh debuffs (DoTs) all the time. All damage is double back loaded (DoTs, and you need Savage Roar up). It's very reactive, with a long time span between your input and the output (psychologically, having the output immediately after your action feels more rewarding, so even if the feeling of being rewarded in itself is subjective, it is objectively better to receive the reward right after your own action).

Having a more balanced damage model, where FB did more damage and SR/Rip timers allowed the use of FB, would make Feral a better and more complex spec, but that will not happen in Legion.

- The Affinity talent spec row is a huge disappointment. What it should have done was to grant the Druid class a uniqueness, translating into adding variation to our play style. Fx, you should be able to weave in Balance dps abilities without a heavy loss to your dps. Instead, we talk the passive bonuses. Would it have been borderline OP, if we could suddenly deliver ranged dps or non-trivial healing? Maybe, but it would also - at times - have secured us a spot in the group/raid. Just like abilities with other classes and specs. Instead, the whole class seems pretty gutted right now, because we have had a lot of abilities removed for several expansions now, and the Affinity talent row (which was meant to bring some of it back, by selecting an Affinity) does not deliver high enough performance.

And it just feels like a gigantic missed opportunity. The mechanics are build in, the devs just need to change the output so it becomes worthwhile to have the Balance Affinity. Worthwhile as in: I just shapeshifted to a Moonkin and I will now smack my foes with all my ranged awesome spells! Oh yeah, I'll do it without a dps loss. That would be awesome.

Our Resto Affinity can actually deliver good numbers - but we run out of mana very fast! That is a design flaw.

The spec is fun for the few people who like to apply and maintain buffs (mainly Savage Roar and BT) and debuffs (Rip, Rake) and do this flawlessly for long periods of time. On a single target scenario, doing that entails using five different abilities (two combo builders, two finishers and Healing Touch), with three CDs on top. Those who succeed in that (as in, deliver good dps) seem to have a good time.

For those who seek versatility and variation - formerly the hall mark of the Druid class - you should probably look elsewhere.

Re: Is feral fun this expansion?

Posted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 12:41 pm
by Cluey
I agree with Whitepaw, it isn't really fun any more.
I'm still playing it as I've played it for so long that I can do it quite well, mostly.

I've tried Terror Turkey but feel so immobile and slow, I've even tried it with feral affinity so I can move faster.
There's certainly a large amount of unfamiliarity, for me, with casters in general but it doesn't feel like I'd enjoy it if I got used to it. I've looked into it because the groups I've played with have all been melee heavy, I've never been interested in alts though so to help that balance I tried Balance.
Most irritating to me is out doing solo WQ, it all feels so slow compared to cat. I think I'd have to be an engineer too, for the loot'a'rang. It is quite satisfying to flatten something with a HUGE chunk of "Moon to the Face" but you've then got to waddle over and loot it.

Having typed that out I think I've managed to articulate one of the things lacking as a cat vs the turkey lobbing chunks of moon at things. It would probably wear off eventually but that impact from watching mobs turn into pancakes is quite satisfying.
Contrast that to the feeling of relief I get after the boss fight is over.
I quite like the intermissions on some of the Nighthold bosses too - I'm thinking of Elisande and Gul'Dan here - as it lets me relax a little and gather my thoughts, remind myself what I have to not screw up during the next phase of the encounter.

I know there are a lot of very good players on this forum so this might not be relatable for you, but I get to the end of the fight and wonder how badly my errors screwed up my performance. I make errors just about every fight, I kick myself when they happen but there are so many things going on at the time I choose the wrong option.
Thinking about that now it's triggered by a few things:
1) crazy OoC proc chains leading to me capping energy, or stressing about capping energy, so I press Ferocious Bite...
2) getting unlucky with crits and finding myself energy starved (I have a high crit rate so this shouldn't happen, but that's just been the best gear which has dropped)
3) dying due to too many things happening at once, this doesn't happen too often though
4) dying because I thought I could get the fully buffed Rip up before running away, this probably happens more :(

As we all know, to do optimal DPS we have to line those buffs up and get a finisher off.
I'm sure you've all experienced the frustration of lining everything up but your target moving away before you can cast Rip. Elisande is horrible for this.

I think it's those moments of frustration and the concentration required, on increasingly long fights, which is counteracting the fun I used to get. Couple with how much effort it takes to get it all right only to be beaten by a paladin with their, comparatively, simple 'rotation'.

Re: Is feral fun this expansion?

Posted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 2:08 pm
by Kroníc
As someone who returned to WoW after taking a break from SoO, feral isn't "hard" but it does require you as a player to be attentive of your bleeds, cooldowns, etc. while still doing mechanics properly. My biggest issue since coming back is having Rip/SR sync up and having to reapply bleeds early and not using FB (a habit I had to stop doing since returning). One month later, 2 legendaries (Boots and Luffa) and feral just feels natural again. My experience so far since coming back is people in general have had poor experiences with feral players either not doing high dmg or just think we're bad in general. When M+ groups are looking for 900 ilvl and they ask if your boomkin and you say feral, they reply with lol no, its not the greatest feeling in the world but get into a group and prove you can pull better numbers than someone 910+ and they're like "WTF your feral?!" and it feels great.

I still choose to play feral over another class because I don't find any other class keeps be entertained/planning out my rotation. That being said, its probably not the best choice for progression if your not in that group of people who can maintain damage while still doing mechanics properly. Not many people I know that played feral in SoO/WoD.

Since coming back in March, I've had to play catch up with AK/AP grinding until the recent patch made catching up easier. Cleared Normal/Heroic NH, cleared Agatha at 900 ilevel (Wish I had it lower to be in the exclusive sub-900 club).

Re: Is feral fun this expansion?

Posted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 9:06 pm
by Istaro
Whitepaw wrote:The short answer is: No, it's not fun this expansion. I judge this objectively, based on how many people actually raid with the spec.
I'm not sure if the latter necessarily means the former, given all the potential confounding factors like feral being 1/4 of a class instead of 1/3, melee being generally undesired, our additional disfavor among raid leaders both justified (no immunities, bad at short-lived priority targets, etc.) and unjustified (prejudice), and probably most importantly, the fact that the feral rotation is designed to appeal to a player subset that's smaller than those for most other DPS specs.

For example,
Whitepaw wrote:psychologically, having the output immediately after your action feels more rewarding, so even if the feeling of being rewarded in itself is subjective, it is objectively better to receive the reward right after your own action
although it'd probably be surprising to the majority who fit this description, this isn't actually an objective truth, because it depends on the person. For me, for example, having a greater delay between action and damage feels more rewarding. As for why, who knows—it'd take more psychoanalysis than I care to engage in (might be similar to the sentiment behind the saying "revenge is a dish best served cold"), but e.g. a delayed kill with Lunara in HotS or Zilean in LoL à la Fist of the Northern Star is immensely more satisfying for me than an immediate one.

Re: Is feral fun this expansion?

Posted: Wed Apr 26, 2017 4:50 am
by Nich
Cluey wrote:I agree with Whitepaw, it isn't really fun any more.
I think I'd have to be an engineer too, for the loot'a'rang. It is quite satisfying to flatten something with a HUGE chunk of "Moon to the Face" but you've then got to waddle over and loot it.
Sure, balance doesn't have 150%+ movement speed, but flight form is only one global.

Re: Is feral fun this expansion?

Posted: Wed Apr 26, 2017 6:15 am
by Kairee
Feral cat has amazing looks and I absolutely had a blast playing feral in WoD (and "staying relevant"), but I have rerolled to Assassination rogue after a Mythic NH boss or two.

I don't find the legendaries interesting (I've gotten Prydaz, Chest and Gloves), I find the rotation very frustrating when dealing with mechanics, I feel like certain things in feral working against each other (like Gloves & Ashamanes Rip & 4-setbonus).

In my first week of raiding with the rogue, I was doing more dps than the feral. While it had lower ilvl, only one dps legendary (the belt) and no tier bonus. And it took me less effort.

I did not enjoy M+ as feral, cause I felt like I was crippling my group.

Fun cat? Definitely, but my rogue is just better for raiding and M+. I can make a difference in my raid with all the 'ignore mechanics' skills that I have.
There's some really fun stuff I can do with the rogue, I just didn't find anything like that on the cat.

Also, I do feel like I've gotten the "wrong" legendaries on my feral, while my rogue got two of the three BiS items as 3rd and 4th legendary.

Re: Is feral fun this expansion?

Posted: Fri Jun 09, 2017 3:11 am
by teddabear
I don't like quite a few things about Feral mechanics in this expansion.

The expansion has numerous dealbreakers as well. I'm not sure who their target audience is but it is the opposite of me.

World of Warships is amazing though so I am still playing quite a bit of WoW.