Sigh... Is My Kitty DPS hitting a wall?

Face-rippin fun.

Moderator: Forum Administrators

Post Reply
Posts: 1
Joined: Fri Jul 12, 2013 6:03 pm

Sigh... Is My Kitty DPS hitting a wall?

Post by Vilaria » Fri Jul 12, 2013 6:16 pm

Hey Fluid Druid folks!

I'm a new poster, but I've regularly browsed the forums for specific raid encounter tips and such and looked at all the hard work that went into calculations.

Lately, I feel like I'm doing all of the tricks to maximize my dps-- using Nature's Swiftness to get me a DoC proc in conjunction with Tiger's Fury to get an ultra-pumped Rip off on my target. I always refresh Rake with a DoC proc, I keep up Savage Roar.

Yet, it feels like it's not enough, that I'm hitting some sort of wall that I can't get past. I see hunters and the warlock in my raid group just snowballing out of control on the professional slopes and I'm still stuck at mediocre bunny hills.

My raid leader's trying to crack down on "mediocrity" and I just don't know what to do. On Lei-Shen, I'll have all the stops pulled out; yet, even when I nail my ideal opener, the hunters and warlocks are cruising at maybe 30-50k over what I did.

Is it my gear? ... ria/simple
I'm not really well versed when it comes to World of Logs, but here's a link to our most recent farm night. Please disregard Horridon-- not because ferals have a funky time with it-- but because I had a stomach malfunction. I'm expecting a baby, you see. >.>

I was told I was pretty bad on Council, great on Jin-Rok (we skipped Tortos and Megs through some raid lock hopping), that Durumu is not my fight, "okay" on Primordius, Dark Animus is hard to judge, and "not my best" on Iron Quon. Now, I'll admit I wasn't exactly trying too hard earlier in the raid night-- to me, it was farm, so I didn't feel a need to go ham and blow pots-- but I felt that later on, with fights that weren't exactly our strengths, I put a lot in. I'm not sure what logs I should link-- I can't remember dates.

Anyway, here goes: ... etails/81/

If the link doesn't work, I apologize-- again, I'm not too keen on World of Logs. I'm an English major, you see, and words are more my specialty. Doesn't mean I don't want to put out good numbers for my raid. ;)

A small note on my raid's iLevels (as calculated by averages): Our ranged dps pool sits at 528 (6 members), tanks at 522 (2 members), healers at 518 (5 members), melee dps at 518 (2 members).

I would greatly appreciate any assistance from this community.

Posts: 151
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2011 4:05 am

Re: Sigh... Is My Kitty DPS hitting a wall?

Post by RareBeast » Fri Jul 12, 2013 8:49 pm

Some thing to consider is that if you feel you are struggling a little, it may be worth switching from DoC to HotW. While DoC is higher theoretical DPS, it can also be more punishing if you get it "wrong" and don't quite make optimal use of it for the entire fight. Simplifying the rotation with HotW allows me to focus better and maintain better uptimes on my bleeds etc.

I'll leave it to the experts to look at your logs properly though :)

User avatar
Posts: 290
Joined: Fri Dec 24, 2010 1:57 pm

Re: Sigh... Is My Kitty DPS hitting a wall?

Post by Steakbomb » Fri Jul 12, 2013 9:18 pm

Looking at your gear there are a few easy things you can fix. It doesn't seem like you have any of the legendary quest stuff done like the Meta gem, extra socket to weapon, or cloak.

I understand if you haven't seen the drops but you should be using the Jin'Rokh helm as your off piece and get the other teir pieces.

There are multiple pieces from just LFR that you could use like Wrists(Horridon), Belt(Ji-Kun), Neck(Maegera), Boots and Tier(Qon), and Rune of Re-Origination(Lei-Shen). You should be running this every week to get these pieces.

Download Catus: and reforge your gear better, you are WAY over expertise cap and over on hit. Catus is an easy way to fix your reforge.

You are not using your CD's effectively at all. The fights I looked at, you are using Berserk 1 time as well as an Agi Pot 1 time. For instance your Horridon kill was 8min 32sec. You could have used Berserk 3 times during that fight and if you pre-pot then you can use 1 on the pull and another when you use Berserk.

You should definitely switch to HotW for the time being until you get more comfortable with the rotation and using CD's. HotW vs DoC is around a 4% DPS difference IF played correctly to it's potential and there aren't many people that can do it. HotW gives you a Tranq(making you more attractive for progression fights) and gives you 6% more agility. The biggest thing HotW will do is make your rotation much easier. Less clipping and not worrying about DoC procs.

There is a very hard line between a good feral and a great feral when it comes to DoC, if you play it incorrectly, it hurts you more than helps you. HotW will give you more consistent damage and allow you to focus on using CD's and keeping SR/Rake/Rip/Trash up on the target.

I play HotW almost exclusively except on farm bosses. I use it for the extra raid CD for the most part and I would love to be able to be DoC all the time but some fights my tranq has saved wipes. If you are around the same gear level as your other raid members, there is no reason you should not be on top or near the top of your meters. I came to my guild a few months ago around 10 ilvls behind everyone else and was still topping the meters. Ferals are in a really good place for most fights.

User avatar
Posts: 162
Joined: Thu Feb 14, 2013 5:15 pm

Re: Sigh... Is My Kitty DPS hitting a wall?

Post by Cetlysm » Fri Jul 12, 2013 9:19 pm

Just some gear stuff, no RoR, set4,meta, cloak and skinning alone are hurting you really really bad.
On durumu your rip and rake could use a bit more uptime.

Posts: 1046
Joined: Tue Feb 08, 2011 5:51 pm

Re: Sigh... Is My Kitty DPS hitting a wall?

Post by ShmooDude » Fri Jul 12, 2013 9:40 pm

Look at the bleed up times on your ji-kun (your good boss) vs other boss

Ji-kun you have 90.5% and 88.1% for rake and rip respectively.
Council you have 88.3% and 81.9%
Durumu you have 81.7% and 71.3%
Primordius you have 59.3% and 47.4% (mine were about 80 and 60 last time; not the highest uptime fight since you have to leave to get rebuffed)
Iron Qon you have 78.8% and 73.5%
Horridon it says your active time was 61.8% but you didn't die? did you dc? so not even gonna look at that one.

Rake should be 95%+ on non-target switching fights (meaning you're primarily targeting one thing and burning it, ji-kun can be either depending on if you do platforms, council, durumu and iron qon qualify of the ones I listed) and 85%+ on target switching ones (primordius, horridon and ji-kun in your case)
Rip should be 90%+ on non-target switching fights and will vary a bit more depending on the kind of target switching fight (higher on horridon than primordius cause adds take longer to kill)

I second the notion of switching to HotW for a while. DoC is essentially "expert" mode for those that have mastered the rotation and are looking to get a little more oomph.

What do you use to determine what you should be doing? Aside from uptime, the other factor is how strong your bleeds are which needs to be monitored. You can use either DroodFocus or Leafkiller's Ovale script (both of which are found in the stickies at the top of the forums). I *highly* recommend the latter but it depends on whether you like being told the (mostly) "right" action for the situation (some don't like being told explicitly what to do) or being able to make those determinations for yourself and having all the data (in droodfocus, a green light on the bleed means overwrite it with a new one, which also has the byproduct of helping uptimes). I usually say ovale gets you 90% of the way there (vs "perfect" ability use) which would be WAY ahead of where you are now.

But primarily its your uptimes (80%), secondarily is probably bleed ratios (20%).

Posts: 1
Joined: Sat Jul 13, 2013 11:04 am

Re: Sigh... Is My Kitty DPS hitting a wall?

Post by moon-crown » Sat Jul 13, 2013 12:30 pm

Some excellent advice above.

I would echo a few of the easy wins:
Uptime is the number one priority, if that means the odd sub-optimal bleed its better than no bleed.
Pots are cheap no reason not to pre-pot every boss farm or not
Unless there is a very good reason to save it, plan to use Berserk close to on CD
Think though the mechanics of each boss and how you may need to deviate from the idealised dps priorities for practicality
You really do need to run the Legendary questline, Metagem, weapon socket, iLvl 608 back, with further upgrades in 5.4

Until a few weeks ago I was running HOTW which on many fights was used for Tranq but just sometimes my RL let me Hurricane (its fun hearing the casters go green watching your DPS), I switched to DoC for HC Tortos. I can usually pull more with DoC but sometimes it goes wrong, if you are going to be under pressure from your RL on dps HOTW should help your consistency. The one thing I would say is that DoC can help out healers and cats not stressing healers is a big plus for progression.


Do not be afraid to petition your RL to use your strengths to their best effect.

I note you have reforged hit to expertise on your weapon when you are already over exp cap.
Use a reforge optimiser to work out a coordinated set of reforges
I no longer ignore gem socket bonuses in general - but you can check this on a case by case basis.

You should consider using some VP to purchase the 522s available from the vendor in the cave. They aren't the best itemised but still better than 496s

Do you have all your procs conveniently visible in your UI ? Weak Auras addon can be excellent for this but is a little complex. A combination of DroodFocus and NeedtoKnow can also work fine.

Finally IMHO we play kitties because we like the rich complexity of the DPS, if we wanted to have a "Push for DPS" button we would all be mages ;) Its a constant learning experience and a lot of fun.

PS/ Don't be afraid of a little theorycrafting, you do not need to be a Maths Major to understand most of the key issues for feral. Even playing with a few formulae in a spreadsheet can help a lot with seeing what matters most.

Post Reply