Blood in the Water

[Konungr]

My and another Feral had a, I wouldn't call it a disagreement, but rather a point of interest that a more knowledgable feral might be able to touch upon.

When you put up Rip on a target at 25% and then use FB, does the "extended?" Rip keep the same stats (Agility, Attack Power, etc) as when it was put up via Rip, or does the 2nd Rip gain the stats at the time of FB.

For instance, whenever I use Rip at 25%, I have become accustomed to using my Ancient Petrified Seed, Potion of the Tol'vir, and Tiger's Fury to ensure that my last 25% Rip has ~9.6k Agility and 15% increased damage behind it. Does that 9.6k Agility continue throughout the duration of the Blood in the Water, or does it lose the excess agility when I FB without those 2 buffs active?

[Konungr]

Here is my ranked Ragnaros parse, where I believe I managed to do this, but I am having trouble looking into the specifics at the time of the 25% duration to check my theory.

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-2 ... 933&e=5536

[Aurea]

it shouldn't, all extendible dots(swp/corruption/rip) take a new snapshot of your stats when they are extended.

[Yawning]

it shouldn't, all extendible dots(swp/corruption/rip) take a new snapshot of your stats when they are extended.

This is correct, unless they changed it since I looked at it last (unlikely).

[Stenhaldi]

A DoT "extension", as via glyph of shred, keeps the original stats. A DoT "refresh", as via blood in the water, uses a new snapshot. At least this was the case a few months ago when I was figuring out how to optimize buffed rip uptime on heroic Nefarian.

[Vorticose]

Code: Select all

[22:13:29.538] Konungr casts Rip on Ragnaros
[22:13:29.986] Ragnaros's Rip is refreshed by Konungr
[22:13:30.303] Konungr Rip Ragnaros *24638*
[22:13:32.333] Konungr Rip Ragnaros 11960
[22:13:33.692] Konungr casts Ferocious Bite on Ragnaros
[22:13:34.132] Konungr Ferocious Bite Ragnaros *12847*
[22:13:34.353] Konungr Rip Ragnaros *21424*
[22:13:36.415] Konungr Rip Ragnaros *21424*
[22:13:38.446] Konungr Rip Ragnaros *21424*
[22:13:40.505] Konungr Rip Ragnaros *13277*
[22:13:42.517] Konungr Rip Ragnaros *21425*
[22:13:43.971] Konungr casts Ferocious Bite on Ragnaros
[22:13:44.300] Konungr Ferocious Bite Ragnaros 7183
[22:13:44.422] Konungr Rip Ragnaros *19078*
[22:13:46.312] Konungr Rip Ragnaros 9261
[22:13:48.539] Konungr Rip Ragnaros *19077*
[22:13:50.545] Konungr Rip Ragnaros 9261
[22:13:52.471] Konungr Rip Ragnaros 9261
[22:13:54.312] Konungr Rip Ragnaros *19077*
[22:13:56.355] Konungr Rip Ragnaros 9261
[22:13:58.382] Konungr Rip Ragnaros 9261
[22:14:00.417] Konungr Rip Ragnaros 9261
[22:14:02.454] Konungr Rip Ragnaros 9261
[22:14:02.861] Konungr casts Ferocious Bite on Ragnaros
[22:14:02.969] Konungr Ferocious Bite Ragnaros *12974*
[22:14:04.420] Konungr Rip Ragnaros 7952
[22:14:06.418] Konungr Rip Ragnaros 7952
[22:14:08.532] Konungr Rip Ragnaros *16381*
[22:14:08.541] Konungr casts Ferocious Bite on Ragnaros
[22:14:08.749] Konungr Ferocious Bite Ragnaros 19901
[22:14:10.317] Konungr Rip Ragnaros 9145
[22:14:12.431] Konungr Rip Ragnaros *18113*
[22:14:14.440] Konungr Rip Ragnaros *18114*
[22:14:16.557] Konungr Rip Ragnaros 8793
[22:14:18.323] Konungr Rip Ragnaros *18114*
[22:14:18.904] Konungr casts Ferocious Bite on Ragnaros
[22:14:19.233] Konungr Ferocious Bite Ragnaros *30037*
[22:14:19.973] Konungr's Rip fades from Ragnaros

So yeah - looks like it recalculates on Ferocious Bite

[Fonia]

Yea that's the way I always understood it. Refreshes take a new snapshot of your stats but it keeps the # of CP from the original rip.

[Orka]

Could this mean then that you may want to FB only when your Rip only has 3 seconds left, even during Berserk ?
Imagine that you cast your Rip at the last second of your trinkets procs, it's buffed with them, but 5CP later (possibly 3 GCD if your 3 Shreds critted), your trinkets procs having faded, your FB will refresh an unbuffed Rip, whilst your first Rip still had about 18seconds left on its duration.
FBing too soon could then mean a loss of dps on the first rip. During Berserk, should one spam shred at least during these first 20sec ?
O.

[Konungr]

Could this mean then that you may want to FB only when your Rip only has 3 seconds left, even during Berserk ?
Imagine that you cast your Rip at the last second of your trinkets procs, it's buffed with them, but 5CP later (possibly 3 GCD if your 3 Shreds critted), your trinkets procs having faded, your FB will refresh an unbuffed Rip, whilst your first Rip still had about 18seconds left on its duration.
FBing too soon could then mean a loss of dps on the first rip. During Berserk, should one spam shred at least during these first 20sec ?
O.

IIRC, Leafkiller or Alaron did some testing on this and it came back that it is an DPS increase to Bite at every 5 CP, except for SR ofc, during BitW phase.

[Orka]

Ok so I guess there's no need anymore to make sure one applies a buffed Rip when approaching/entering the last 25% of a boss' HP... I'm kind of disappointed, I thought this trick was part of being a good cat. But let's think positive, I guess if BL is used at 20%, and one uses one's CDs at that time, the Rip gets eventually buffed, and potions and TF can be lightheartedly saved for maximum Berserk shredding/FBing frenzy. Maybe it's just one small Rip dps optimization stuff off our mind for the intense last few minutes of a fight.

[CaptainCub]

Ok so I guess there's no need anymore to make sure one applies a buffed Rip when approaching/entering the last 25% of a boss' HP... I'm kind of disappointed, I thought this trick was part of being a good cat.

This has never been part of our mechanics though.

[Orka]

Edit:*double post*

[Orka]

Ok so I guess there's no need anymore to make sure one applies a buffed Rip when approaching/entering the last 25% of a boss' HP... I'm kind of disappointed, I thought this trick was part of being a good cat.

This has never been part of our mechanics though.

It has, for those like me and apparently Konungr too, who mistakenly thought the BitW refreshed Rip was keeping the stats of the base Rip, hoping this would increase their dps if they managed to put a violent Rip into BitW phase.
I even suggest we do some lobbying to obtain this change :p
"You may say I'm a dreameeer, but i'm not the only ooone..."
O.